Sandrine: Navigating the Silent Shifts of Motherhood

In this vulnerable session, Chelsea sits down with French Canadian wellness coach and author Sandrine Lavoie-Filion to discuss the profound identity shift that often accompanies motherhood. Despite years of experience as a kinesiologist coaching pregnant and postpartum women, Sandrine reveals the stark difference between theoretical knowledge and the internal reality of becoming a mother.

Sandrine opens up about her unexpected journey into motherhood, the shame she felt when her initial reaction to a positive pregnancy test was fear rather than joy, and the challenges of bonding with a baby who didn't initially "feel" like hers. She describes how she used journaling to navigate postpartum meltdowns and the loss of her former self, eventually turning those private reflections into her book, Uncensored First Time Mom Confessions. This episode is a must-listen for anyone who has ever felt like "the problem" while navigating the complexities of their new parental identity. 

🔑Key Takeaways

• Theory vs. Experience: Even experts can feel overwhelmed; Sandrine discovered that knowing the physiology of postpartum is entirely different from living through the hormonal and identity shifts.
• The Complexity of the "Positive" Test: It is valid and common to feel scared, overwhelmed, or even shameful when learning of a pregnancy, especially if it wasn't planned or if you previously questioned your desire to have children.
• Delayed Bonding is Normal: Unconditional love isn't always instantaneous; for many, it is a relationship that grows over time through the routine of care and mutual discovery.
• The "Golden Hour" Myth: Labor is physically and mentally exhausting; Sandrine highlights that wanting to sleep rather than have a "magical" bonding moment immediately after birth is a valid reaction to sleep deprivation.
• Journaling as a Healing Tool: Putting thoughts on paper allows parents to externalize their "spiraling" thoughts, navigate the root causes of meltdowns, and release the shame associated with their feelings.

💬Sound Bites

• "I realized now that there's a big difference between what you can know about pregnancy and postpartum versus how it actually feels."
• "Who would have thought that becoming a mother brought so many questions about yourself, but also the type of mother you want to be?"
• "I had that pregnancy test saying I was pregnant. And I was just scared, overwhelmed, and I didn't know how to feel."
• "I think it's unrealistic to say like, this is a new human being and I'm supposed to have this unconditional love for him. I don't know him."
• "When you write it down, when it's on paper, it's so much easier because you can go back to it... understand it better... and ask yourself questions."

Transcript

Chelsea Myers (00:01)
Hello! Today I am here with Sandrine. How are you today?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (00:07)
I'm doing pretty good. I'm doing my best, you know, we've changed daycare, so the sickness is happening. So I'm in the middle of, am I going to be sick? Am I not going to be sick? But so far, I'm doing pretty good. So pretty excited to be here.

Chelsea Myers (00:20)
Yeah. ⁓

I'm excited to have you. I always love when I get to talk to my friends up in Canada. I was just telling you earlier, I have a piece of my heart in Canada and it just makes me so happy. And crossing my fingers for you that you do not get sick. ⁓ And we're going through the same thing with my youngest starting preschool and my oldest is in fourth grade. It's just constant sickness. So we feel it. We feel it. Yeah. ⁓

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (00:35)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (00:50)
Again, you've listened to a couple of my episodes. You know that I don't like to ramble off my list of things I know about you. Listeners love it so much more if you could kind of give us a little taste of who you are today, as well as who you are, who you were before you became a mom.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (01:10)
Yeah, because well, those I feel are two very different people, honestly. So my name is Sandrine Lavoie-Filion I'm French Canadian. So this is why I have a lovely accent. I'm a wellness coach. I'm a kinesiologist, ⁓ mostly coaching women online for hormonal imbalances, for emotional, mental health and...

Chelsea Myers (01:20)
You

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (01:33)
everything based on like, you know, body composition and everything. And I had so many clients before that were pregnant that went to postpartum. And, know, I've realized now that there's a big difference between what you can know about pregnancy and postpartum versus how it actually feels. So like nowadays, my approach is a little bit different. Like I approach things very differently because now I have experienced it. ⁓ And, you know,

I would say that before I became a mom, I was very much the type of person who would keep everything to herself, wasn't vulnerable, wouldn't, you you were asking me how I'm doing. I would tell, oh, I'm fine. And that's just the thing. It didn't matter like what was going on with my life. I would just go through the motion, do the things I should be doing. And then I became a woman and you know, I had so many questions and I questioned so many things about myself and I struggled.

Chelsea Myers (02:07)
Mm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (02:29)
for a long time, honestly, because I thought I was supposed to have it all together. I thought I was supposed to be this perfect mom. I thought, you know, like, I'm supposed to have it all figured out. I'm supposed to do all these things and easily. And I'm supposed to love all of the parts of motherhood. And that wasn't it, you know? And I started to question so many things. And I am ⁓ now an author. I've started journaling throughout my pregnancy, and that has helped me a lot.

Chelsea Myers (02:45)
No!

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (02:58)
And I started journaling about all of the things I was feeling, all of the things that I thought I wasn't supposed to be feeling and everything. And this wasn't meant to be a book at first. It was just supposed to be for me. But then I started sharing it with some friends and all. And I realized that so many mothers felt the same way I felt. And I decided to publish it because I didn't want someone else to be like, what's wrong with me?

Is it a me problem? Like everyone's telling me it's going to be beautiful and magical and so easy and it's going to be perfect. And it didn't feel like that. So at one point I was like, I'm definitely the problem. Something's wrong with me. Like what is happening?

Chelsea Myers (03:38)
It's me. Hi.

I'm the problem. It's me. Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (03:42)
Exactly.

then, but now the more I'm having conversation with people, the more I realized like, no, no, it's, it's not me. Like we can all relate to those things. So by publishing it, was like, well, it's a way for someone that maybe is struggling, maybe had the same people telling her the same thing. Like it's going to be beautiful and magical. Be like, okay, maybe it's not a me problem. Maybe it's just that we don't talk about those things. And now I want to talk about those things. So now I've.

started writing, I'm still writing about, you know, like all the things that I thought I wasn't supposed to say, all the things that I wasn't supposed to share, all the taboos, things that have happened that we usually, you know, like, hush, we keep quiet. And that's what I'm doing now. So I'm questioning everything that I thought was, you know, all my limiting belief, all of the things about myself I thought were right like, is it really the right thing to believe? it?

the person I want to be, you know, so my identity has changed a lot, I would say, since I became a mom and I'm having so many questions, like who would have thought that becoming a mother brought so many questions about yourself, but also the type of mother you want to be. Yeah, so I went through a big identity shift once I became a mother and the more I progress, honestly, I'm starting to like that version of me. So I'm pretty happy with it.

Chelsea Myers (04:49)
Hahahaha

Yeah. Yeah.

I love that. I love that so much because ⁓ you've touched on so many common themes that I hear from so many guests. And every once in a while, I get a guest that's like, I'm the same. I feel like I'm the same person that I was before. And that's not something that resonates with me. It's so that's great for them, right? Like that's their journey. I think that's amazing for them. Yeah, I think a lot of us though.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (05:23)
Not at all. Yeah, yeah, I'm happy for them. Good.

Chelsea Myers (05:32)
really do go through this huge identity shift and you do start to question everything, your values change, your needs change, your wants change. And I was also thinking as you were describing it, like that curiosity. We associate that so much with like watching our kids grow and seeing them be curious about the world. But there is a part of us as parents that gains this new curiosity and need to like learn and grow and understand.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (05:59)
Definitely.

Chelsea Myers (06:00)
Yeah, so I loved that you that you talked about that a little bit. I also love that you acknowledged like, yeah, I've worked with a lot of people through pregnancy and postpartum. And I thought I had this down like this. I had this in the bag. was this. Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (06:11)
Yeah, I'm really good with theory, you I know everything that's happening.

I can make a list, you know? But like how it actually feels internally going through the hormonal shift, going through that identity shift. Like at first, when I wasn't a mom, most of my coaching was really more just focused on nutrition, exercise, and then like, what are we going to do? We're going to make sure your pregnancy is safe and we're going to keep working out. We're going to make sure you have a good recovery.

Chelsea Myers (06:18)
Yeah!

Mm-hmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (06:39)
Now I'm more so like mental health focused and like, how are you feeling? And then identity shift and all of that. And talk about emotion. Like I've had, I've had meetings with people that we haven't even talked about nutrition. We haven't even talked about it. We're just talking about other stuff that's happening throughout it. And that's a big difference in how I approach it now. And something, you know, past me wouldn't have thought of.

Chelsea Myers (06:57)
Yeah.

No, it's one of those things that you just can't you can't until you've gone through it. Yeah, it's like on paper on paper. looks like like I worked with infants for years. And on paper, I probably should have had it in the bag. But I most certainly did not any right like it's just it's life. It's life. ⁓ in that vein, did you always anticipate becoming a mom? Was that always something on your to do list?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (07:10)
Yeah.

Yeah. definitely.

So it's the thing that, you know, as a child, as a kid, I would say, yes, I'm gonna have two kids. I'm gonna have kids one day and all. And then I started growing up. And then, you know, in the middle of all of that, I think it became a thing that, you know, is expected. You're expected as a woman to have children. So I didn't really question if I wanted children. It's just like, well, one day I will have children. And so, you know, I became an adult.

And eventually I had my own life. I was doing my own stuff. didn't have, I had responsibilities, but not that many. And I liked my life as it was. Like, it's just the thing. I liked it that way. And then my husband always wanted to have kids. And then we started this back and forth thing of like me saying, give me five years and then, give me four. Okay. Then we're at three. And then we got stuck at three because he wasn't counting. But then I just realized at one point I was like,

Chelsea Myers (08:22)
You

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (08:27)
I don't feel ready and I don't want to have kids just because the countdown has gone down and we're like, ⁓ well, zero. Let's go. Let's make the kid. So the closer I would get to actually becoming a mother, the more I started questioning it and be like, OK, but wait, do I want kids? Is that really something that I want for my life? And I had so many.

Chelsea Myers (08:34)
time now. Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (08:52)
examples around me as well, and then with clients and all of people being overwhelmed, you you say it's beautiful and magical, but people having multiple kids and just being overwhelmed, not having time for themselves and all. I was like, well, now I have time for myself. Like now I can actually do my own things. Like, is it a good thing for me? And there was also this questioning of, you know, like it wasn't always easy in my childhood and all of that. And you don't want to pass that along.

generational trauma, you don't want to repeat that behavior. So also like, should I be a mom? Like, am I going to be a good mom? Like, I don't want to have a kid and then just screw him up for life. And then he's just going to resent me for it. Like that's not what you want. So I was kind of like at a place that I was questioning it. I didn't know if I wanted to be a mother or not, but also I was also just going through the motion still.

And so I would just keep going with my life and be just like, let's push that thought away. You know, it's a problem for later. Like, I don't need to think about that right now. Like, let's circle back another time.

Chelsea Myers (09:57)
That's problem

for future Sandrine. Not for today.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (10:01)
Exactly. Like,

we'll see it. And then I became pregnant. yeah, so ⁓ we were just like changing from provinces to provinces, like moving a lot. And then I lost my family doctor and I just couldn't get my pill to be renewed. And so at one point I was like, okay, well, know, like so many women nowadays struggle to get pregnant. we could be trying and it could still take like a year or two or it could just not happen. So I was like,

Chelsea Myers (10:06)
Unexpectedly or?

Mmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (10:31)
That's not a big deal. Like I'm just, I don't have any more of my pill That's fine. Like we're just going to stop and we're going to be careful and it will be fine. It wasn't. See? So I got pregnant and you know, that was a big roller coaster of emotion for me because at that point, you know, it's one thing when you're not sure if you want to be a mother or not to like question it a little bit, but then when you know you're pregnant and that

answer has to come to you like right now because it is happening. It was so scary and overwhelming, but I also felt so ashamed of my reaction because I had, you know, that friend that was trying to get pregnant for a while and couldn't, and she would have been overjoyed. She would have been over the moon. She would have been so happy if she had learned that she was pregnant. And I was there with my pregnancy test. had, we weren't trying. I had that pregnancy test saying I was pregnant.

And I was just scared, overwhelmed, and I didn't know how to feel. I didn't know how to reach out to people also because that's not something you usually tell people. Usually people go like, congratulations, you're pregnant. This is so exciting. And I'm like, thank you. But I don't know if it's like good news or not. And then I went through this whole spiral in my head again of like, should I be a mom? Like, you know, what will happen? Like what are...

Chelsea Myers (11:34)
Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (11:58)
Because you know, like being a mother 100 years ago or so, like a long time ago, it's just expected, it's gonna happen. Nowadays, we have more option, but women also have more responsibilities. It's not just, you need to be a good mom, you're gonna be also a good wife, but you're also a strong independent woman. You need to have those things and then you might have your business, but you're gonna have a kid.

but you're supposed to bounce back as well. Like you're not supposed to look like you're gonna have, you just had a kid. Like there's so many things around that. And also like, I'm very active. I had just done my first triathlon and I was like, will I still be able to do those things? Like there's so many restrictions as well. So many new responsibilities. And once you become a mom, you're a mom. It doesn't stop for a weekend. You know, it doesn't stop for a week. You're just, from now on, you are a mom. So there's just like so many things that

Chelsea Myers (12:44)
Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (12:53)
got me so many questioning that entered. then, you know, like also my body was full of hormones. I had like numerous like meltdowns and it was in a good situation for me. But yeah, it was the thing that I was still questioning it. I didn't know if I wanted it or not and it happened.

Chelsea Myers (13:02)
You

And I think it's important. Well, it feels important for me to tell you all of those feelings are valid. I think even too, families that want to get or are trying to get pregnant, I think there are so many people that experience those questions when you get the positive pregnancy test, because then it becomes real, right? Like, before that, it's an idea. And then you see those two lines.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (13:17)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Chelsea Myers (13:39)
And you're like, ⁓ okay, this changes everything, right? Or it has the potential to change everything. And again, I'm so appreciative. Like you said, you weren't like a big sharer before, but you are, you're so vulnerable right now, like in sharing that you had like that shame and you had that guilt and those doubts. And I think that that's so common, but not easy at all. Not easy at all.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (13:40)
⁓

Yeah.

Yeah, it's part of my healing

process. know, like I was the type of person who wouldn't share anything and now I'm becoming more comfortable having those conversations. But it also depends on the person. Like I feel like some people are just not receptive to having those conversations. Like I know your podcast and like, I know this is a safe space. So, you know, I'm willing to talk about all those things. I'm willing to be very vulnerable because I know someone will relate and someone probably needs to hear it.

Chelsea Myers (14:33)
And I'm so appreciative. I'm so appreciative that ⁓ you consider this a safe space. That's our whole goal. And like you said, someone out there needs to hear it. Someone may be listening to this today and just had that pregnancy test and be thinking in their head like, ⁓ my God, what does this mean? Yeah. I mean, okay, so let's moving beyond that, even though that's huge, that's a huge shift for you.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (14:47)
Mm-hmm.

What am I gonna do? Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (15:02)
going into the pregnancy and going through the pregnancy, how did you sort of navigate that and those ups and downs of, my god, what does this mean for me as you're going through the pregnancy?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (15:15)
Yeah.

Yeah. Well, the first couple of weeks, first couple of months were pretty hard. And my husband was, you know, over the moon, overjoyed, so excited. And he was so supportive. So he helped a lot. But, you know, like there was always like in the first couple of weeks, there was this thing of, know, I didn't look pregnant. So there was this thing of I think I was still in denial about it. You know, like as long as no one knew, nothing was happening.

Chelsea Myers (15:35)
Mmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (15:44)
I was still the same person. So for a while, I think I just stayed in denial until my husband really wanted to start telling people and all of that. I kind of had to deal with those feelings, deal with like family reaction around that. And I was still struggling to navigate it, but I think at one point, like, so I am very much... ⁓

Chelsea Myers (15:44)
Right.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (16:06)
So this is my position. I feel like I need to say it, but I do very much believe that women should have the right to choose. I just knew it wouldn't be my choice. ⁓ But we had that conversation, that painful conversation, like, what are we going to do? And then as soon as I took my decision that this is not a choice for me, I just tried my best to move along with it. But I was still a bit in denial. And then I got this.

Chelsea Myers (16:16)
Mm-hmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (16:34)
medical appointment where, you know, like they tried to hear baby's heart rate and all, and they couldn't hear it. And she tried for like 10 minutes and nothing. And she went back and then found someone else to help and then nothing. And in that moment, that's the moment I really realized like, oh, I actually got attached a little bit to this baby. Like, because before that, you know, I was still in denial and I was like, you know, like whatever happened will happen and then we'll see what's...

Chelsea Myers (16:41)
⁓

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (17:03)
We'll see because so many women also have miscarriages and also like, I don't know what's going to happen with that pregnancy. But then I got to the fact that, wait, maybe something's wrong with my pregnancy. And at that time, I wished so badly to hear that heartbeat. I wanted to hear it. And I think that's the moment that made me realize like, okay.

maybe it's a good thing. Like maybe I should become a mother. Maybe that's going to be okay. Like that's really when start like things started to shift So at that point, I think things started to shift with my whole pregnancy. You know, I felt a little bit disconnected as well because I was still a little bit numb.

and not really feeling my feelings and just going through the motion. You know, like, OK, this is life. You you're going to have kids and all. And you're just going to do this thing because that's what you're supposed to be doing. So I just kind of like went through the motion, did what I was supposed to do without really questioning too many things. And it's more so like when I was postpartum than how I actually started feeling my feelings and then really come to term with everything. Because I think I went through my pregnancy disconnected for

Chelsea Myers (18:07)
Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (18:13)
A long time, honestly.

Chelsea Myers (18:15)
Yeah, I love that you pointed out, even though there was that shift in you where you did realize like, okay, yes, I do want this to happen. This is a very wanted pregnancy. It's still okay to acknowledge that there was a disconnect. was hard to form.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (18:32)
Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (18:34)
like an attachment. again, I don't like to make episodes about me, but that does resonate with me that does like, even though you can feel them moving around inside you and stuff like, you know, it doesn't register that it didn't register for me that it was like a baby, like my baby. I was like, yeah, yeah. But you're like, yeah, there's just I mean, there's just something living in me right now.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (18:43)
Yeah.

Yeah, like you're pregnant, like you feel it, but...

Yeah, it's like you're still you,

you're still doing your whole life. Like you were before, but like, you know, you're bumping into stuff and then you have to be careful with a couple of things, but it's still you. Like nothing has changed much. Like there are some changes, but your life hasn't gone through this big shift yet.

Chelsea Myers (19:05)
Yeah

Yeah, so let's walk through. Of course, I feel like I'm speeding through, but like you mentioned, once baby came and once you were postpartum, all the feels started happening. Take me through your birth experience. What was that like?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (19:34)
It took a long time, honestly. I started contracting on the Friday evening. I was very much like, was 39 weeks plus like five days or so. And I had just had ⁓ my doctor's appointment that day and they were like, okay, if you're still pregnant next week, we're gonna book you for an ultrasound and all of that. And at that point I was done. You're all big and I'm done with that pregnancy. And I was like...

Chelsea Myers (19:36)
Yeah.

Yeah. ⁓

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (20:02)
I'm going to have that baby. Like it is time. It's happening. So I went to the gym and I did this big workout. And then all of those things, you know, that are supposed to induce your pregnancy. was like, I'm doing it. I was this like 39 week pregnant lady running on the treadmill. You know, there was me, everyone was laughing, but it worked anyway. So I started contracting, but I didn't have my baby until the Monday evening. So I contracted for the whole weekend.

Chelsea Myers (20:09)
Hahaha

Yeah.

you

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (20:31)
It just became more more more painful. You you're not hungry. You're barely eating anything. It's so hard to sleep. You know, I started having those contraction and I would have contraction at first, you know, for 30 seconds, like every eight minutes. And you know, like you're supposed to contract for like 60 seconds every five minutes or so. And, you know, the numbers weren't there, but still very frequent and all. And then the pain just kept increasing. So

I had trouble sleeping. It was not a great experience, but no complication really until I got to the part that, OK, you're ready to push. And then I started pushing. as soon as I started pushing, they're like, OK, it needs to happen right now. I need you to push now. It got done in five minutes. But then he wasn't crying. He was in.

Chelsea Myers (21:20)
Whoa.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (21:24)
As soon as he got out, like I had a doctor, a baby had a doctor, they took him to the side of the room and they asked my husband to come and they were like, talk to him, do something. Like he, he was a little bit like blue and like no sound, like barely kind of like breathing and all. Like everything was fine throughout my whole pregnancy, throughout the whole contracting thing, everything was fine. I started pushing, heart rate dropped. So it took a little while for him to actually make little sounds, little squeaks and all.

Chelsea Myers (21:48)
Mm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (21:54)
and for me to have him kind of like on my chest. But at that time I had been sleep deprived for like three days. I had barely eaten anything. And there was this thing like right after labor, I got this adrenaline kind of flush. So basically like my whole body started shivering. I was shivering uncontrollably. I was so cold. They would put blankets onto me. I just couldn't control it. And they were like, don't fight it.

Chelsea Myers (22:14)
Mm-hmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (22:23)
But I was sleep deprived. I had now like blankets over me and I could actually relax because the pain was gone. And then now I have my baby, but I was so sleepy. Like I did, like part of me, I didn't realize I had had a baby, but part of me just wanted to sleep also. So, know, when those people tell you like it's the most beautiful day, it's like the best day of my life. Like it wasn't like.

Chelsea Myers (22:41)
Yeah!

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (22:49)
You know, I was in

Chelsea Myers (22:50)
Yeah

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (22:51)
pain. It was a long day. I was tired. And yes, I had a baby, but I just wanted to sleep. So we just got through with breastfeeding. And then after that, I just passed the baby to my husband. I was like, I need to sleep. I'm just not functioning. So it was just a long process to get to just push for like five minutes and then a lot of stress as well, because you've went through all of this and then you think you're having a healthy baby. And then no, baby's not crying.

Chelsea Myers (23:06)
Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (23:19)
why is he not crying? And at the time I was so grateful to have a doctor for me and then a doctor for my baby because they were like, the team was great. And then my doctor was just kind of like walking me through what she was doing and then doing like trying to distract me. And I had a very pragmatic doctor, which I think really helped me because I just asked her a question like, is he okay? And then she just looked over for like 30 seconds and look back and be like, yeah, he's fine. I'm like,

A lot of people I told that story to were like, what? That's all she told you? But for me, it was actually reassuring. Because if you can look at the screen 30 seconds, come back and say, yeah, yeah, he's fine, and tell that to the mother, I feel like he's going to be OK. I feel like you've seen enough pregnancy and enough delivery to be like, yeah, this is normal-ish. Because a lot of kids take a little bit of time, actually, to start breathing and all.

Chelsea Myers (24:10)
normal-ish, yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (24:17)
At the time I didn't know that, which was very panicking. Yeah. But then it kind of like reassured me. So after we got done with breastfeeding and I'll just pass him along and I just passed out, I needed to sleep. And then it's just like three hours later that then I woke back up because he needed to be fed again. And then we started this whole motherhood journey. That was kind of like the start. Now you're a mom.

Chelsea Myers (24:19)
Well, right, how would you? Yeah!

Yeah.

Yeah, I'm insanely jealous that you were able to be like, okay, I'm gonna sleep and that you were able to sleep. That's so amazing. I know it sounds like it you deserve that three hours of sleep. my gosh. ⁓

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (24:51)
Yeah, I was exhausted.

Yeah. yeah.

Chelsea Myers (25:02)
And yes, for listeners, I didn't know that either. I didn't know that C-section babies have a harder time breathing. And it's the same reason why babies who are delivered really, really quickly, like you said, you pushed for five minutes, they have trouble breathing because they don't get that good squeeze. ⁓ And so they don't get that jumpstart to their lungs that tells them, okay, you gotta start breathing on your own. Yeah. So... ⁓

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (25:14)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

It's his time, yeah.

Chelsea Myers (25:28)
tuck that in your back pocket if you're expecting right now. Right. Yeah, just so you know. ⁓ yeah, that doctor sounds amazing. It reminds me of a ⁓ nurse on social media, Jen Hamilton. She's a labor and delivery nurse. And she's always like, if I'm not scared, you don't have to be scared. Yeah. Yeah. yeah, and not even I've seen worse. It's just like, look at my face. Do I look scared?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (25:31)
Yeah, just so you know.

You're okay, yeah. I've seen worse, you know, you're good.

Chelsea Myers (25:56)
I'm not scared. You don't have to be scared. ⁓

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (25:57)
Yeah, yeah, because you don't

tell the mother of the baby he's fine unless you're 100 % sure he's fine, you know, that was my way of thinking. So I was like, I was still nervous a little bit, but like, it helped calm me.

Chelsea Myers (26:04)
Yeah!

Yeah, I love I love that. ⁓ so yeah, let's talk about you didn't get that like, the golden hour that everybody raves about with the rainbows in the sunshine. You took a nice nap. And then you and then you got baby back. Did it start to hit you that this was real at that point? Or did it take a little longer?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (26:20)
Yeah.

Yeah.

It took a little longer, but you know, like we got started the next day with just routine. You have a baby, you do the routine, know, breastfeeding, you change the diaper, you swaddle and then goes back and then he sleeps again. And then, so we just went through the motion. went through the motion like I did, you know, part of my life. So that day I just went through the motion, but what happens that the next night we couldn't get him back to sleep unless he was on me. So I got to have, you know, that baby contact, but just.

Chelsea Myers (27:01)
Mm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (27:04)
delayed so that night you know from like I think it was like 1 a.m. or like 2 a.m. to like 4 a.m. 5 a.m. like he couldn't sleep other than on me so I got to have him on breastfeed him and he just you know was there laying on my chest and he was just looking so cute and every time like you know the nurse was coming in and then maybe try to breastfeed him again like I would try but then he would just fall back asleep so I just decided well I'm just you know gonna leave him here and

He looks good, like he was comfortable. So I had that little moment, you know, of like, this feels good. And then starting to kind of like build a connection. But I think that's the thing, like, you know, people say, ⁓ you have this unconditional love, what that happens when you get your baby. I don't think that was the case for me, you know, like I think.

It grew over time and I got to have a little bit of that experience like the first day and then for a couple nights afterwards, it was kind of like the same. He wouldn't fall asleep unless he was on me. So I got those contact naps and all. But I think it's unrealistic and I'm happy for all the mothers who got to have it. But I think it's unrealistic to say like, this is a new human being and I'm supposed to have this unconditional love for him. Like I don't know him.

Chelsea Myers (28:21)
Yeah!

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (28:22)
we

need to get to know each other like any other relationship in life. So I think my connection with him kind of like grew over time. What I hadn't realized though is how much pain I would feel when he was screaming. Like when he like the first diaper change, you know, like my husband was doing his best, like he wasn't hurting him in any way. But my baby was just screaming at the top of his lung. Like he doesn't understand what's happening.

Chelsea Myers (28:37)
Mmm.

you

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (28:51)
And when he got down, I was just like, give me my baby. I was just like, like, I just couldn't take it. And for the first couple of months also, like, well, the first year, let's say my first year or a year and a half, or like every time he would like scream and then cry, I would be like, I need to do something. He needs to stop crying. And I think that also helped kind of like build that connection with my baby because I was like, I need to comfort you. I need to reassure you. it felt painful to.

Chelsea Myers (28:55)
Ugh.

Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (29:21)
hear him cry versus like my husband could be like, he's fine. And I was like, he's not like he's crying. Give me my baby. Like I'll take care of it. But yeah, so it took a while for me to really feel like I was connecting and all. And then, you know, he started smiling. He starts looking at you. He starts saying mama and all these things. And then you're like, my God. And it's so full of love. And then you're like, okay, yeah, I'm definitely a mom. You're like, yep, this is a thing. Like, yeah.

Chelsea Myers (29:29)
Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (29:49)
You see the identity has started to shift. But a big part, think, for me of the shift happened a couple of weeks postpartum, you know, because at first I was just going through the motion. We're doing this thing. We're doing this thing. But like maybe like the third week postpartum, still very tired, you know, like it haven't been really rested because I'm breastfeeding every like two to three hours and all like we're just.

doing this thing, like you're still cramping a little bit, you're still bleeding, you're still sore and all. And I used to be that person, you know, who was very active, who was setting like a workout goal, like I'm going to do this thing and I'm going to do this race and all. And now like I got back into it, like because I needed to get back into it, like my body felt it, like my mind also needed it to start moving very soon after labor and all, but I...

couldn't do the same thing I was used to doing. Smaller distance felt so hard when running. I was still sore. My abs were still sore. It was like millions of pins and needles going through my core all the time. So a big part of how I used to value myself as a person was just gone. All of those things that made me me, that made me that person that I value, they were just gone.

Chelsea Myers (31:05)
Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (31:12)
And like, I understood that I was now a mom, that I had value as a mother, but it had never been how I defined myself before. So, you know, in a way it's like, I understood that, but it was, it didn't feel like, like I had any value anymore. Like I couldn't do all of these things. And you know, you're always, you smell like milk, you're always a little bit gross. And then like, you know, you're getting peed on, you're getting puked on. Like,

Chelsea Myers (31:39)
Yep.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (31:41)
You know, like this is is the experience you're you're emotional, you're tired and all. And I had lots of meltdowns, honestly, because I and then sometimes I couldn't understand why I was having meltdown, you know, that that's also the thing I would try to explain it. But I probably would would fail at explaining it. But, know, like that day, I remember I was just, you know, I had just taken a shower and then 30 minutes later, I was breastfeeding and then he just peed through his diaper and I was just

You know, there was just pee on me again. And that just started the tears. I was just like, this is it. Like I can't even be clean for like 30 minutes. And, you know, I needed to be there every two to three hours to breastfeed. So I wouldn't go out anymore because like I went to just a store and then my husband would call me and like he woke up and he's hungry. He's crying. Like you need to come back. And then I would be just ashamed because I wasn't there. I needed to be there. And then now my baby's crying and I'm not there, you know.

Chelsea Myers (32:13)
Yeah.

Yep.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (32:41)
to do

my job, like the only job I have right now, basically. So it was a really hard period because I had to now question myself a lot into like, okay, what has actually like value to me? Like, I think before I used to value myself with like external validation law, like the things that I was doing. And when those things weren't present, that's when, you know, like I have a big identity shift and I was like, who am I?

versus now I'm trying to value myself more as like, am I as a person? So that has been kind of like the big shift, but also like, you you want to see your friends, you want to go out and then, you know, but then you think it's like, you have a baby. So let's talk about the baby, which is good. But sometimes I'm like, I want to talk about something else. Can you, I've had friends like, know, like they're not like moms, they don't want kids and all. And I was like, tell me about something else. Like, what's...

Chelsea Myers (33:23)
Yeah? Yeah?

Please!

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (33:37)
I

want something else in that word. I was like, everything that was happening in life was just around, you've had a baby, let's talk about it. I went to baby groups and all, but it was just diapers and all that. So that was just what I was in. And it just didn't felt like me at the time. So that part was probably the hardest part, I would say, ⁓ just emotionally and then mentally.

Chelsea Myers (34:05)
Yeah. I ask this of everyone because we were all sort of promised this village kind of like you have a baby and there's a village. Well, that's not really the case. Did you have any sort of systems of support where you I know you mentioned like you couldn't even go to the store without your husband being like you need to come home he needs to eat. ⁓ Did you guys have anybody supporting you to even get a breath every now and then?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (34:33)
So we lived about like five and a half hours away from my hometown. So my parents, his parents were like six hours away and all. We knew a couple of people around, like, you know, like people that also have kids also have things, they're busy on all of that. So we didn't have that much support. And yes, that's also the thing, you know, people say like, you need a village to raise a kid. And I was like, well, where's my village? Because most of my friends are actually long distance as well.

Chelsea Myers (34:37)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (35:00)
You know, my closest friends are long distance. They're also five and a Like I didn't get to, you know, I want to break. I'm going to call my mom. Can she come in and all? I didn't get to have that. So my husband, like he was, ⁓ he was lucky to have like the paternity leave. So there was like both of us at home. And so I have like a, my business and I couldn't get maternity leave. So I had to kind of like dive back down, but I was also trying to work throughout all of this, which just added like an, another layer of pressure. So it was like,

Chelsea Myers (35:15)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (35:28)
me and my husband just kind of like dealing with that. But we kind of stuck at home. Yes, going outside and all, but always with the baby, always having. So my, just to give you an idea, like my baby is now like two and a half year. And I think last weekend we've had our third date night since he was born. Yeah. So, ⁓ it was, was great. It was great. It was great. But that's

Chelsea Myers (35:47)
my gosh. ⁓ my gosh. Yeah, I hope it was a good date night.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (35:57)
the thing, like my village was like so far away. And sometimes I would get comment after the fact of like, well, why didn't you tell me? Like I would have come and all, but then, you know, like when you're trying to get help, it's always hard to get it. Like you're asking and it always seems hard. So you stop asking, you know, in some ways, or, you know, everyone has their own life and not everyone can drop everything.

Chelsea Myers (36:18)
Mm-hmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (36:24)
to do a six hour drive to come and help you out for like a weekend or so and then come back. And then like not everyone can do that. And I had lots of people tell me like, but like come and then I'll help you out. But then I have to do the drive. So it's like, you know, 12 hour drive in my weekend, we're in a new environment. So he's not gonna sleep. So he's gonna have separation anxiety. So he's gonna wanna stay with me. So we're just gonna be in another environment. I'm still not gonna be arrested. We're just gonna be tired. And so it was just...

Chelsea Myers (36:38)
Yup.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (36:53)
wasn't helpful in a way. And unfortunately, I had a lot of people in my village also being supportive-ish with their comments, in a sense that they're trying to give you so many advice, so many comments and all, but sometimes they're just not helpful, or they make you feel worse about yourself than other. So at one point, sometimes I was struggling internally and not telling anyone, of course, that I was struggling. But...

Chelsea Myers (37:10)
Mm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (37:21)
You know, also sometimes I was like, I think I'm better off, you know, on my own. Like, I'm just going to like, I think it's better for me to handle this than to have comments about what I could do better. You know?

Chelsea Myers (37:25)
Yeah.

Oh,

yeah. And I know that they're probably so well-meaning, but like, it's so hard, especially when you're in the thick of it. It's just like, how about we, how about you just keep that comment to yourself?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (37:37)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah,

and like there's a big difference is like, if I ask for your advice, good, ⁓ I want it. If I don't like stop, like, and then some people just don't get that I guess.

Chelsea Myers (37:55)
Yeah.

⁓ and again, I try to like give people the benefit of the doubt. think it comes from a place of love, but it's so hard. So hard. So you mentioned this in the beginning when we were talking about this journaling, journaling, which then became your book. When did that start becoming a coping tool for you?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (38:05)
Of course it is. Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

I started really in the postpartum months. So that's when I really got started. From my pregnancy, I was just going through the motion. And then I started writing. Like writing was the thing that everyone told me, you you should start writing and all. I was like, yeah, sure. I don't have time for that. You know, like, yeah, sure. Yeah. Like, I'm sure it's great for some people, but not me. And then I actually started doing it because now I had decided to dial back with my business. And also like sometimes I was just like, yeah.

Chelsea Myers (38:36)
Right, like in all my spare time that I have, yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (38:50)
just gonna write things. And I just wrote about all the things I was feeling, all the things that, you know, at that time, I think I would have really wanted like one of my friends to be closer on to be able to actually just open up and all. So I wrote it in how I would have talked to that friend, how I would have like, what I wish I could tell, like everyone and I just wrote all of it down, all of it. And then I was like, no one's gonna read it. So

Chelsea Myers (39:07)
Mmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (39:19)
So I was able to be totally honest with myself and to write everything down because I wasn't going to do anything with that. And then I started sharing it with some of my friends, one of my friends who was pregnant at the time. And she got back to me and she was like, yeah, this is so great. And she could relate so much. And one of my friends came back to me and she was like, yeah, it's great. But I was thinking, how do we market this? And I was like,

We don't market this. This is not a marketing thing. This is just me, that wrote and all. So that's how it kind of became a book because I then started thinking to myself, I'm on this whole journey as well to be more vulnerable and more open and talk about these things. And it's great that now I'm able to talk about it with my friends, but what's the next step? If I could talk about it to everyone, that would be kind of the end goal. So I was like, well,

Chelsea Myers (39:45)
What?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (40:12)
Publishing it would be it. That would be the goal. Everyone would be able to read it. All of my most intimate thought, everyone could be able to read it, which is very scary. But that would be the end goal. So that's what I did. But when I started writing, it was just me pouring it all out. How did I feel? ⁓ if I was angry, everything that was happening, if I was sad. And also, was a way for me to navigate it all. Because I'm

Chelsea Myers (40:38)
Mm-hmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (40:40)
I went back to also like my pregnancy. And when I had those meltdowns, was like, I don't even understand why I was having those meltdowns. So I started navigating it and trying to say, okay, but like, why was I so overwhelmed? And I'm like, what were the reason? And then I started thinking, yeah, because of this, because of this. like with, after like a couple of months, I feel like when I was having those meltdowns, I could have been able to navigate it all and to be like, yeah, this is why.

of course, like this is why I'm having a meltdown today. But with having gone through the pregnancy and like a year later now was able to actually like dial it back down and be like, okay, now I understand. And this is like what has happened. So it has helped me in a lot of ways also get rid of some shame because you know, when you learn that you're pregnant, your husband is so excited, you're giving him the big news and he's over the moon, overjoyed and then you start crying.

Chelsea Myers (41:20)
Mm-hmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (41:35)
It doesn't feel good, you know, like it's his big moment, the moment he has waited for, for so long. He is so happy and his wife starts crying. I ruined that moment for him, you know? So, so there was a lot of shame about me because I was like, I ruined the moment for him. But then afterwards I was able to understand, you know, like everything that I went through and to also give myself grace for a lot of things, you know?

Chelsea Myers (41:36)
Yeah.

⁓ no.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (42:01)
all

of those moments that I thought, what's wrong with me? Like, this is my fault. Like, ⁓ I'm just like numb. Like, I'm supposed to be filled with love and all. So I went back into all of these things that I thought were supposed to happen and what was my experience. And it was good to be able to kind of compare it all, but also good to be able to be honest with myself. Because I think that's probably something I haven't been doing for most of my life, you know? Just went through the motion, but...

Chelsea Myers (42:29)
Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (42:31)
didn't really take the time to stop, to ask myself question and to figure it out like, okay, who am I? Like, what do I want? And to actually be honest with myself with that. So there was a lot of questioning and journaling really helped because I was just putting it down on paper and was able to go through it again and reread it and be like, but maybe that's not it. Maybe this makes sense more. You know, like when something's in your head, when you're spiraling, everything is there. It's so hard to make sense of it.

Chelsea Myers (42:42)
Yeah.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (43:00)
When you write it down, when it's on paper, it's so much easier because you can go back to it, you can reread it, you can understand it better, you can change it, can try a couple of things, ask yourself questions. And I was mostly asking myself lots of questions and then trying to answer them. So that's mostly how it got started. So it really helped into, first of all, feeling my feelings because I had also a couple of breakdowns when I was writing because it brought up so many emotions I hadn't felt.

Chelsea Myers (43:25)
Mm-hmm.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (43:28)
but really just understanding myself. And it started a big healing journey and a big process that I am still not done with that. And I don't know if I will ever be done with that, but it is, yeah.

Chelsea Myers (43:40)
It's a journey. It's a journey, right?

Yeah. so some of the themes that I want to touch upon that I love so much about just hearing your story is it's been this evolution ⁓ even before being pregnant, right? Like even the questioning, is this something I want? Is this something I really want? ⁓ And I'm not going to say that

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (44:05)
Mm.

Chelsea Myers (44:08)
becoming a mother was necessarily the catalyst to this big change in you, but it was a piece of the puzzle. What I also think is so important about your story and why I'm so glad that you're sharing it and that I'm so thankful for your book, which we will talk about where to find it in just a minute. I love that and something that's important to you is that

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (44:17)
Yeah.

Yeah

Chelsea Myers (44:35)
you don't have to have this big traumatic story or this huge... you don't have to have something that seems on a bigger scale to be like a tragedy to still struggle in motherhood. that also sounds negative, but I don't mean it negatively. I mean, it's okay to question yourself. It's okay to

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (44:40)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (45:05)
ask yourself, who am I? It's okay to be like, I don't know who this person is, this new baby. I am not, this is just a new roommate that I need to feed all the time and figure out and right? Like we don't know each other. We've got to get to know each other. And I also so appreciate that you so readily talk about that, that you're like, yes, I, I loved him and I learned to love him. But like, I was also just going through the motions because I didn't know what the heck was going on.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (45:10)
Thank

Yeah.

Yeah.

Chelsea Myers (45:35)
That's huge. That's because I think that that is a more common experience than we are led to believe. ⁓

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (45:44)
Yeah, and you I had a lot of self doubt also like publishing this book and all just because like you said, I didn't have like a traumatic birth experience. I didn't have like a traumatic pregnancy and all. So part of me always kind of like invalidated all of my feeling being like, what are you complaining about? Yeah, you're fine. Like some people almost die there like in labor and you're fine. What are you complaining about? So it's a big part of like

Chelsea Myers (46:03)
Right!

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (46:09)
you know, invalidating your emotion, being like, yeah, I feel that way, but I shouldn't, and then try to kind of like bury it down. So there was a big part of me also when releasing it that was like, I'm pretty sure a lot of people will be, you know, like she's playing the victim, like she's just like, oh, complaining and all of that. But there's so many of us that will go through like a good pregnancy, you know, by standards and still will go through a roller coaster of emotion and feel guilty because of it, because I had

Chelsea Myers (46:25)
Ugh.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (46:39)
You know, like in my head, was like, well, I have no reason, you know, to feel that way. Why are you overwhelming? Just try to be grateful, you know, like just be grateful. You have a baby. So many people struggle. So I was invalidating so many of my emotion and not giving me permission to feel them because I was like, no, I need to, you know, like so many people have it worse. I need to be better. I need to feel better about this. So it was definitely a really hard journey there for me.

Chelsea Myers (46:48)
Ugh.

Well, I'm thankful that despite the self doubt and the the questioning that you did choose to be vulnerable and that you did choose to share that because again, I'm going to keep saying it. This is going to resonate with so many people. Parenthood and motherhood is not easy. And especially today, like you mentioned at the beginning with bounce back culture and hustle culture and all these things.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (47:11)
No.

Chelsea Myers (47:34)
expected to be so many things. It's okay. It's okay to not love being a mom every second of every day. So before, before I get to my wrap up question before we get there, I want to make sure listeners know where to find you and where they can find your book. It is on my list. I have so many and I'm trying to get through all of them. my gosh. Well, geez.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (47:43)
Mm-hmm.

It's so hard.

Chelsea Myers (48:04)
everyone that I've met so far has created something and shared it with the world. And they're all so beautiful. And I can't not read it or watch it or whatever it is that you guys have created. Yeah, so it's on my list. I just haven't got there yet. Where can listeners find you if they wanna follow along your journey?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (48:22)
That's okay.

Chelsea Myers (48:28)
and where can they find your book?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (48:30)
So if you want to follow along my journey, so my full name, Sandrine Lavoie-Filion on Facebook, Instagram, my handle on TikTok is my self-published saga. So I self-publish my book. So you can find it on Amazon. It's available also on Kindle Unlimited or on Kindle. Eventually it will be available on bookstores. I just need to work on that ⁓ side of things for now. But I actually brought it ⁓ if you guys want to see it.

Chelsea Myers (48:51)
You

Yeah, first time mom confessions uncensored.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (48:58)
Yeah,

Uncensored First Time Mom Confession. I wanted the book to feel different than a maternity book in the way that it's not a how to change a diaper book. It's not a like, you know, like parenthood book. It is just my emotion, what I went through, how I felt through it. And what I wanted was for, you know, new moms or even just like women to read it.

And to be able to feel and just to have that safe space, same as what you've created with that podcast, to be like, yeah, it's OK. You can feel whatever way you feel. And that's totally fine. You have that space. And I've had so many reviews so far with mothers, but also women who don't even want to be mothers and have been able to relate to so many of the emotions. And some men that also just wanted to read it because you know, like,

Sometimes they can want to be the perfect partner and they're still not really capable of understanding what we're going through. So it's a way for them as well to be able to understand the feelings. Like they see what we're doing and all of it, but sometimes it's hard to understand what your partner is actually going through internally. yeah, uncensored first time on confession on Amazon, but yeah, you can find me on Facebook, Instagram and TikTok for that. I have also my website.

Chelsea Myers (50:10)
Yeah.

You

and all of the-

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (50:21)
So it's just ⁓ HTPS, know, www.sandrine-lavoifillion.com.

Chelsea Myers (50:28)
and all of that will be linked in the show notes. Listeners, please check the show notes so you can find all of those things. I have started switching up how I end my episodes and I've changed my question. ⁓ So it's just a little bit of a, well, I don't know if it's a fun exercise. You can tell me at the end, but. So.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (50:41)
Okay.

Okay, we'll see.

Chelsea Myers (50:54)
kind of doing I'm asking my guests to kind of like go back in time to nowadays we just text each other send each other voice memos or whatever back to our childhoods when we actually had to like leave people messages on the phone if we wanted them to know that we called them. ⁓ so you have no idea who my next guest is going to be. You don't know what their story is going to be. You don't know anything about them. But I'm asking you to leave a message for them.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (51:10)
Mm-hmm.

Okay.

That's interesting.

Ooh, that's a lot of pressure.

Chelsea Myers (51:23)
You're calling, they

didn't answer, you've got, can be anything, anything you want. You're just going to leave a message for them. The fun thing is, and I don't know if this is self-serving or not, but to get your message, you're going to have to listen to the episode before yours when it comes out. Right? So, but this is your message to my next guest. What do you think you'd like to leave for them?

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (51:40)
⁓ okay.

I'd like to leave with, well, first of all, thank you for being there. Thank you for sharing because I know how sharing and being vulnerable, how hard that is because it's been so hard for me. So thank you for being there. Thank you for sharing your story because I think sharing your story is a big part of healing probably for you, but also for all the listeners. And I think we need more people to share their story, to be able to relate, to be able to

make all of these things that we think it's, you know, something is wrong with us, that we think, you know, it's an us problem. Like we need to normalize those things. We need to have the space. We need to hear more of people's stories. And I'm incredibly proud of you for doing that, for being here, for sharing your story and to be able to be vulnerable and to be able to be honest and authentic.

Chelsea Myers (52:43)
I love that. So as tricky as I know that that must be, and I know I'm asking a lot of you guys when I try that, I have loved every single message that everyone has left because they're so beautiful for each other. I'm excited. They are so different. I'm excited for you to hear yours when it comes out, right? ⁓ But I just, again, I have loved spending time with you this morning.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (52:57)
And they're probably so different.

I definitely will go.

It was amazing.

Chelsea Myers (53:12)
my goodness, I am just so thankful for you. I'm thankful for you for being vulnerable and learning that that is hard and doing it anyway. So thanks for spending some time with me today.

Sandrine Lavoie-Filion (53:24)
Well, thank you for giving me the space, you know, to be vulnerable and to have that podcast, you know, for so many people to be able to listen and to relate and to have the space to also be vulnerable because I'm sure a lot of your listener have also, you know, never been in a place that they had that safe space. So I think we need that.